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Post by madamemonday on Oct 17, 2012 21:32:03 GMT -5
Inspired by fic writing, as per usual.
I've been thinking about the tattoos, and how exactly they come about. Like, let's take Nathan. His manifested as he was in the showdown with Duke in the season 2 finale. Others have them as well, but how they got them are never explained.
My theory is this: the Troubles have stages. The first is the initial emergence of the Trouble, brought on by anger or some other high-stress situation. The second might be the appearance of the tattoo, again triggered by a high-stress situation.
I also think that the location of the tattoo isn't set in stone. Remember Julia? It appeared briefly on the back of her left shoulder. Also, her speaking about how the symbol appeared in her family line lends credence to the idea that along with the Troubles, the tattoo is hereditary as well. But as Jordan proved, just because you have the tattoo doesn't mean it's an automatic ticket into The Guard. I hope we learn more about that connection in later episodes.
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Post by killabeez on Oct 17, 2012 21:49:34 GMT -5
I hope we get more info about this, too! If I were at one of these conventions where you can ask questions, this would probably be mine.  It keeps throwing me that they talk about Nathan's tattoo as if he went out and got it inked on, when I'm not sure that's what happened. And he keeps not contradicting that assumption. I went back and watched 2.11, and he definitely does not have the tattoo in that episode. But you don't see his arm in 2.12 until the moment when the tattoo is revealed. So, he could have gone to get the tattoo the same night that he went to the meeting of the Troubled. That seems so unlikely to me, though. It seems much more likely that the tattoo simply appeared there in the moment of conflict with Duke. I assume the tattoo shows your alignment (Troubled or Not) and Julia's was undecided because she didn't align herself either way. But yet, she was in conflict with Duke, so maybe that was enough to trigger it? It seems that not all the Troubled are automatically part of the Guard, but the Guard is there to protect the Troubled. |
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Post by madamemonday on Oct 17, 2012 21:55:17 GMT -5
I went back and watched 2.11, and he definitely does not have the tattoo in that episode. But you don't see his arm in 2.12 until the moment when the tattoo is revealed. So, he could have gone to get the tattoo the same night that he went to the meeting of the Troubled. That seems so unlikely to me, though. It seems much more likely that the tattoo simply appeared there in the moment of conflict with Duke. Though it does bring up a good point, would Nathan having gone to the meeting have set in motion the triggering of the tattoo? Like, all he needed was the push and Audrey's abduction was it? I assume the tattoo shows your alignment (Troubled or Not) and Julia's was undecided because she didn't align herself either way. But yet, she was in conflict with Duke, so maybe that was enough to trigger it? It seems that not all the Troubled are automatically part of the Guard, but the Guard is there to protect the Troubled. YES YES YES. *bounces up and down excitedly* This OMG this. |
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Post by killabeez on Oct 17, 2012 22:11:34 GMT -5
Though it does bring up a good point, would Nathan having gone to the meeting have set in motion the triggering of the tattoo? Like, all he needed was the push and Audrey's abduction was it? Yes, I think that might be true—specifically because he goes to the meeting after someone says to him that he has to choose a side. It's weird that they keep talking about it like it's a tattoo, though. Like, I wonder if he even knows that he didn't go get the thing inked on, you know? If making the choice to align himself one way or the other might be affecting his judgment and/or perceptions? |
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dordoris
Drunk and Disorderly
Posts: 208
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Post by dordoris on Oct 18, 2012 10:33:32 GMT -5
I think about that a lot I think about Haven a lot. When that tattoo magically appeared and disappeared on Julia's back (I love her, btw, I wonder if she'll come back), I was very interested about how it happen, she was angry and that triggered something?
When it "appeared" on Nathan's arm, it looked like he was actually inked, the extremities were red/soured, like he just got it. And why would he do that just to kill Duke? It doesn't make sense to me.
And there's another thing. In 1x5, when Nathan and Audrey were looking for the id of that old dead body, they talked to the guy who designed the tattoo, why they don't go talk to him again?
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snacun
Citizen Of Haven
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Post by snacun on Oct 18, 2012 11:05:17 GMT -5
The way Nathan talks about it, it seems to me he actually did get it inked. He said to Duke that if the person who is going to kill him is having such a tattoo then he wants to be on the approved list.
In "The Farmer" Audrey said he got the tattoo just to kill Duke and he replied he got it to protect her.
What confuses me is when did he have time to get it?
I kind of doubt that when he found Audrey missing he took a little detour to get the tattoo first. So he must have had it before.
What is also weird is that the first guy they found with the tattoo probably had it inked as well cause they talked to a guy who claimed he designed it.
If he designed it how come it is on all those gravestones Julia shows Duke. They seem way older that that guy.
I also noticed there where different versions of the tattoo on those gravestones. Some of them had dots in the corners and some didn't. Do they have different meanings?
So with some people it just appears, some get it inked. There are versions with dots and without. Some guy says he designed it although it seems to go way back.
This is really confusing.
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Post by killabeez on Oct 18, 2012 11:15:27 GMT -5
So with some people it just appears, some get it inked. There are versions with dots and without. Some guy says he designed it although it seems to go way back. This is really confusing. That's why I wonder if it actually affects people's perceptions. It is very confusing, and they do seem to be giving us contradictory information about it. As for when Nathan would have had time to get it, it would have had to be after 2.11. He definitely doesn't have it in that episode, and I don't think he would have had time during 2.12. The last scene of 2.11 is where he goes to the meeting of the Troubled. It seems as though 2.12 starts the very next day (because of how Audrey storms in to the Herald office demanding answers) so Nathan would have had to get it the same night he went to the meeting. He even says something to Audrey about being late the next morning ("We start at 9AM") so it had to be that night after the meeting (AT the meeting?) or else he didn't get it inked. |
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dordoris
Drunk and Disorderly
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Post by dordoris on Oct 18, 2012 11:34:46 GMT -5
So with some people it just appears, some get it inked. There are versions with dots and without. Some guy says he designed it although it seems to go way back. This is really confusing. That's why I wonder if it actually affects people's perceptions. It is very confusing, and they do seem to be giving us contradictory information about it. As for when Nathan would have had time to get it, it would have had to be after 2.11. He definitely doesn't have it in that episode, and I don't think he would have had time during 2.12. The last scene of 2.11 is where he goes to the meeting of the Troubled. It seems as though 2.12 starts the very next day (because of how Audrey storms in to the Herald office demanding answers) so Nathan would have had to get it the same night he went to the meeting. He even says something to Audrey about being late the next morning ("We start at 9AM") so it had to be that night after the meeting (AT the meeting?) or else he didn't get it inked. When Audrey and Nathan met for the first time after the kiss, they set a date for "tomorrow night". He had the time to do it after he realized that Duke could follow his father's footsteps in the end of Sins of our fathers... Hey, I'm a member of the guard now, I should know stuff LOL |
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Post by killabeez on Oct 18, 2012 11:50:45 GMT -5
Ah, thanks, I didn't catch that!
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Post by killabeez on Oct 18, 2012 11:52:56 GMT -5
Interestingly, though, Audrey hadn't told him yet about Simon's journal and about what she learned from Lucy. Wasn't that one of the things they were going to talk about over dinner?
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dordoris
Drunk and Disorderly
Posts: 208
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Post by dordoris on Oct 18, 2012 12:13:23 GMT -5
Interestingly, though, Audrey hadn't told him yet about Simon's journal and about what she learned from Lucy. Wasn't that one of the things they were going to talk about over dinner? I don't know how deep they went in that subject, but when Audrey and Nathan were at the cemetery they saw duke burying his father's weapons. They must have told Nathan, because he says something like "let me get this straight, you can end someone's trouble?", if I am not mistaken... |
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Post by killabeez on Oct 18, 2012 13:29:01 GMT -5
Okay, gotcha. I scanned through that episode, but haven't rewatched it in a while, obviously.
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Post by madamemonday on Oct 18, 2012 14:25:29 GMT -5
What is also weird is that the first guy they found with the tattoo probably had it inked as well cause they talked to a guy who claimed he designed it. If he designed it how come it is on all those gravestones Julia shows Duke. They seem way older that that guy. I also noticed there where different versions of the tattoo on those gravestones. Some of them had dots in the corners and some didn't. Do they have different meanings? So with some people it just appears, some get it inked. There are versions with dots and without. Some guy says he designed it although it seems to go way back. This is really confusing. So thinking along that vein, it would make sense that the tattoo artist would design a similar but not identical tattoo based on the existing design that would prove popular with some because it carries a piece of the town's history (though you'd think that it wouldn't be popular given its link to the Troubled). I'm still of the school of thought that some Troubled get it without being physically inked, though. And physically inked or not, it's still a disruption to the skin. Like the physical appearance of the ink irritates and makes it look like someone put it there deliberately. I can only speak for myself, but none of my tattoos had that raised, almost branded look that Nathan's had. Also, I noticed that it was blotchy, which makes me think that it hadn't finished setting in yet. It was much darker after the irritation faded away. Tats have a tendency to fade after inking, not before. Nathan telling Audrey he got the tattoo to protect her seems like a cover. Like he doesn't want to admit he was marked against his will. But now that he has it, he's going to use it to his advantage. Though they did a masterful job of hiding Nathan's forearm in the scene with Duke, so you just can't tell if he had it before the showdown with Duke or it appeared during the fight. Sneaky sneaky. |
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Post by killabeez on Oct 18, 2012 19:40:19 GMT -5
it would make sense that the tattoo artist would design a similar but not identical tattoo based on the existing design that would prove popular with some because it carries a piece of the town's history (though you'd think that it wouldn't be popular given its link to the Troubled). I'm still of the school of thought that some Troubled get it without being physically inked, though. I like that thought, and I agree with the last part. I would like to think that what we saw with Julia was shown for a reason. |
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snacun
Citizen Of Haven
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Post by snacun on Oct 19, 2012 3:18:43 GMT -5
Though they did a masterful job of hiding Nathan's forearm in the scene with Duke, so you just can't tell if he had it before the showdown with Duke or it appeared during the fight. Sneaky sneaky. I agree with you that the tattoo just appears with some troubled but I somehow don't think it was the case with Nathan. If the tattoo just appeared during the fight with Duke. Why wasn't Nathan at least a little surprised? Duke certainly was but Nathan just told him that if Dukes murderer had a tattoo he wants to be on the approved list. I don't think he would have said that if he just noticed he had the tattoo. |
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It keeps throwing me that they talk about Nathan's tattoo as if he went out and got it inked on, when I'm not sure that's what happened. And he keeps not contradicting that assumption. 